Oh yeah, let's switch turtle for an unknown map in the middle of a season. It creates great fun and gives even chances to teams. The ones who can't play it once before the official are going to lose and it's all their fault. Of course, every single player in this game has enough disponibilities to practice on all these new maps + the next maps played in officials.

I am so happy to see how you can manage this season so greatly, swalk.
This season is just getting awesome and extremely cool.

A custom map cup won't give more feedbacks than this, for sure... I'm pretty sure some teams are already agreeing on playing their official matches on maps that aren't in the map pool (because it's awesome to play competitively on maps you don't know). I love how you, swalk, are putting mappers in such a situation. They must take into account feedbacks full of love in no time (so it can be done before it's officially played).

Why the hell wouldn't we rush like this while we have a lot of time to do it correctly ?

NSL is kind of the biggest event organizer on this game. You re making it look great and i love everything in this season.

Unicorns and ponys are my favorite animals.

Thanks for everything.

Oh look ! A butterfly <3


PS : don't get surprised if i'm getting angry and insulting towards people in such situations.

I would much rather see a repeated map in the pool than a map we have even less playtime on as a replacement for turtle. I don't think many people will mind playing an official map again when the alternative is playing an untested, unknown map.

Ok nsl_jambi is updated. Please use the NSL version, as it is a giant pain in the ass to duplicate the changes over 2 map files. The ns2_jambi will not include the changes until I decide to port them over. So if you would like the most recent updated jambi, use NSL Jambi.

Thanks

Regarding ns2_fracture: Another new map to learn? Wasn't enough time already invested in just everyone agreeing that turtle wasn't going to suffice? Now another map that people have to play enough to develop an opinion on?

I'm not saying that every week should just be summit 4 times, but at this point I think the teams would rather play mineshaft or refinery or docking than a map that no one has ever played.

I agree with Ray. I'd MUCH rather replay a map than have to play a brand new map with basically no notification. I've got guys that have real life stuff going on. It was bad enough having 4 weeks notice about Turtle, but now a weeks notice for Fracture? We should have put this in WEEKS ago if we wanted to play it in the season.

We are theoretically playing ALL maps (Summit, Jambi, Tram, Biodome, Caged) twice but Veil, Descent, and Tanith ONLY ONCE. Why don't we instead repeat either Descent or Veil. Hell, I'd even rather put in Docking or even Mineshaft. At least we know how those maps play and there aren't any blatant terrible stuck spots (like how Original Gorges lost a fade on Jambi against us because he got stuck in a random wall).

rayI'm pretty sure some teams are already agreeing on playing their official matches on maps that aren't in the map pool (because it's awesome to play competitively on maps you don't know).
Yeah. That definitely has happened with multiple teams.

Alright, I'll switch it with tram instead. There is no need to be so dramatic about it.
If teams don't play on the given maps, their matches will be discarded.

Hey there. I'll stop perving and come out the bushes now!

NS2_fracture is my map. I can completely understand why you guys are reluctant to take on any new maps at such short notice. I haven't personally put it forward for being entered into the latest map pool as its not out of grey boxing yet. but Multiple comp. teams have played it and the feedback seems fairly positive which led Bonkers to suggest it replaces turtle.

It is essentially grey boxed, but it is fairly bug free, balanced, fun, easy to learn and runs very well. I would only make the case for fracture entering the pool in its current state to get more feedback so I can make the best competitive NS2 map I possibly can. That's simple not going to happen without input from you guys. I have been testing and refining for a long time now and I'm very close to moving onto doing the visual passes. I feel It's really just missing minor adjustments.

You want more competitive balanced maps, and I want to make one. I feel that forcing a map into a league is not the most ideal way of acquiring feedback or gaining publicity for the map. But it seems fairly difficult to get teams of similar skill levels to PCW on a unfinished map. I commend Swalk for helping the mapping community, I am just sorry you guys have not had longer to learn them.

All I can ask is that you give fracture a play and see how you feel about it afterwards.

I'll be updating the map tomorrow with cleaner commander invisible throughout and 10 RT's. It seems to be a fairly easy map to learn so I wouldn't be put off by that either.

Thanks guys

Docking and Mineshaft are probably more strategically diverse than Veil, and have more interesting layouts than 3 different coloured versions of Summit. What Decoy said.

evilb0b, flater and howser are all being absolute sir's about trying to get 3 maps playable for you guys. Stuffing them into the season on such short notice wasn't the best idea, but at least attempt to pcw them without such prejudice. Listening to wasabi on that LS vs Titus scrim was pretty fucking embarrassing. I liked the bit where he thinks he has a clue.

Some of the feedback has been pretty good. Most of it has been useless rage filled trash that can't be taken seriously or be useful in actually improving the map so it can be played in the next season.

In the next season, indeed.

No one is whining about the fact mappers are trying their best to give more diversity to competitive scene on NS2. It's just that putting maps in the pool while we don't even have time to know them is ridiculous.

I d prefer seeing these maps well done and supported by a custom map cup in the middle of this season, or after it, rather than making people upset towards new maps.

I really like giving feedbacks about new maps and help mappers out. The thing is, a regular season isn't the right place for fresh new maps that aren't balanced enough yet.

Swalk redirected the thread and asked for feedbacks about the maps. What matters here aren't the maps themselves. It's practice time that is lacking to a lot of teams. New build came out less than a month ago and some teams haven't adapted yet. Moreoever, new strategies are coming out and need time to get prepared, trained.

The problem stays still... We don't need neither want new maps in competitive season right now. It already started and i still haven't been able to check new caged nor new tanith. I don't have enough players to make a single match.

Come on... Let's just be rational for once please.

Howser
You want more competitive balanced maps, and I want to make one. I feel that forcing a map into a league is not the most ideal way of acquiring feedback or gaining publicity for the map. But it seems fairly difficult to get teams of similar skill levels to PCW on a unfinished map. I commend Swalk for helping the mapping community, I am just sorry you guys have not had longer to learn them.


I think I love you.

I would absolutely love to play this map when we've got time for it. I'll see if we can get some PUGs going on Fracture and I'll try to get some equal-skill-level scrims on this map. We'll try to get streams for it.

I'd love to have a map like this in for next season, just having like two weeks notice for it? Sucks.

Thank you for being fantastic

We have been testing the maps from the SCC (inc. Caged) every week now for many many months, but comp and pub play are like two different games. So far we've tested about 8 competive games on the map or so; its been super helpful. All of these games have involved Bonkers arranging the matches (I owe him and TWAT big-time for their input and help). Getting some more teams playing the map outside of the league matches would be amazing. Especially if you guys can record the games so I can analysis the match for myself. Alternatively you can contact me via steam so I can watch it myself.
http://steamcommunity.com/id/howser/
I have no problem with fracture not being included in this season, ham-fisting it in at this point might do more harm that good with how people perceive the map but I would definitely want to see it ready for the next. Having your feedback, suggestions and recordings makes that a lot easier for me.

Thanks

Dont bend to pressure from snail scum swalk! More custom maps!

This isn't exactly EPL or anything, who cares?

Man you competitive players like to fight it out ay :p

That's why we like you ;)

ns2_tanith have gotten significant updates, I'd like some feedback from you guys. One of the Reactor Room nodes have been deleted, as well as the node in Acidic. Also, Fusion is no longer siegable from Cargo.
Please play tanith if you get the chance and then post gameplay related feedback here.

Edit: I already told Jonacrab to also add more cover to Reactor Room, Cargo and Chemical, so those changes might also come soon.

Caged is still entirely marine favoring, but it seems like no one cares.

I definitely care, and have been making alterations based on the feedback I have gotten (including yours :p) to reduce the marine's OP factor. For the week 7 matches I might be able to incorporate some further changes (primarily to Purification, and how Purification connects to Ventilation) but I cannot make changes in the middle of week 3.

Additionally, if anyone has twitch/youtube recordings of their week 3 matches on Caged, I would really like to be linked to them. I watched Reddog's Gorgebusters vs. TAW stream last night, but it was difficult to gauge undiscovered map imbalances from that match due to the skill imbalance between the teams.

Feedback pointing out specifics are always welcome.

EDIT: Also, I fixed the consistency checking issue that caused problems during the Gorgebusters vs. TAW match. Turns out UWE had removed a prop I was using from the game (the clogs in the ready room), but it should be all right now.

No ray, at least i dont care. Im tired of the dota style maps with 3 lanes.

Caged has come a long way. Flat, you've done a good job responding quickly to feedback. It's still going to need some polish, but the last time I played, the changes made a significant difference. Keep it up.

I have checked all the maps in the map pool for consistency issues with the new version 257, the problems seem to be caused by some files that UWE removed as they were no longer needed by them. In some cases this is minor, in others it leads to some large holes.

Checked and working at the moment:
ns2_nsl_tram
ns2_nsl_veil
ns2_nsl_summit
ns2_tanith
ns2_turtle (just in case)

The following files are missing on ns2_nsl_descent:
"models/props/descent/descent_tools_01.model"
"models/props/descent/descent_wallmods_05a_crn_out2.model"
"models/props/descent/descent_wallmods_05a_str5.model"
"models/props/descent/descent_wallmods_05a_crn_in3.model"
This leads to some notable holes (especially south of Gravity and a small one on the north corner of Launch Control exit). I do not think it affects the game play especially.

The following files are missing on ns2_nsl_biodome:
"models/props/biodome/biodome_stair_01_test.model"
"models/props/biodome/biodome_bench_01_test.model"
"models/props/biodome/biodome_tree_03_01.model"
"models/props/biodome/biodome_tree_03_02.model"
The only hole I found on this after a quick run around is at marine start (I guess the stairs prop). Presumably there are missing trees, but not that I would notice. The missing bench unfortunately I could not find. Again looks completely playable.

The following files are missing on ns2_nsl_jambi:
"models/marine/male/male_black_ammo.material"
Minor decoration from the armoury room I think, did not seem important when I checked there.

The following files are missing on ns2_caged:
"models/alien/gorge/clog_test.model"
Minor "decoration", Flat I believe should be fixing this (remains broken at the moment).

Anyway, this is the updated ignore line from the ConsistencyConfig.json:
"ignore": [ "ui/crosshairs.dds", "ui/crosshairs-hit.dds", "ui/exosuit_HUD1.dds", "ui/exosuit_HUD4.dds", "ui/marine_minimap_blip.dds", "ui/minimap_blip.dds",
"models/props/descent/descent_tools_01.model", "models/props/descent/descent_wallmods_05a_crn_out2.model", "models/props/descent/descent_wallmods_05a_str5.model", "models/props/descent/descent_wallmods_05a_crn_in3.model",
"models/props/biodome/biodome_stair_01_test.model", "models/props/biodome/biodome_bench_01_test.model", "models/props/biodome/biodome_tree_03_01.model", "models/props/biodome/biodome_tree_03_02.model",
"models/marine/male/male_black_ammo.material",
"models/alien/gorge/clog_test.model"
]

Ugh, figures. Found a sneaky missing prop behind a wall. The Spark Editor really needs entity/prop lists so you can actually find things without having to go on an exploration quest.

Should be fixed now.

Cognito, you are the savior of mankind. Thanks a bunch. Now someone needs to update NSL servers with this info, Simba around?

applying the change now. will need some people to test it since I am at work.

nsl_biodome got missing stairs @ marin start.

Could you please remove the vent from agrilabs, falls and bridge.
There is no reason to see it as commander and it would help a lot.

Aiorosnsl_biodome got missing stairs @ marin start.

Could you please remove the vent from agrilabs, falls and bridge.
There is no reason to see it as commander and it would help a lot.

Whoever does the edits for that map could. I am not a map editor so I do not know how to make them changes.

ObliviousSight maintains nsl_biodome, and he told me earlier tonight he's going to get on fixing that very soon.

Btw played nsl_descent earlier and there is a wall missing on Shuttle Bay so you can see the skybox (skybox, is that right?).