Miscaellaenous but important stuff


First of all, there was some debate about server rule (which has been in the rulebook for about 1/2 - 1 years). Basically the current rule enforces to play on non-EU servers in case the eg. europeans have same ping on US server as americans in EU server. While I personally think proper teams don't need natural ping advantage (this is the same as saying "play on EU servers") to win the other team, I know most people in EU are too cowa. reluctant to play anywhere elsewhere (sometime playing in Germany was a big deal), we're changing the rule so both maps have to be played on European servers when requested.

However on the other side, in the next season, we could be arranging a Worlwide Division for non-EU teams seperately from the other divisions. Also european teams could participate in this season at the same time as they participate in regular divisions. The default time could be adjusted to something different from regular one to fit more time zones. This is however just a vision, we need to see what's the situation after this season.

Second thing. New plugin is coming out this week to fix some badass bugs that have been reported to me but also with more features:

Features / changes:
- Rate violation will give 30s time to fix the rate and try to automatically fix it
- /delwp to remove waypoints
- !admin to call a ref in case of problems
- Commander assistation
-> Information when a building or upgrade is complete
-> Popup for building selling (to prevent accidental obs sell)
-> Commander can enable/disable these at own will
-> ... Suggest?
- Menus for refs (you lazy nibbz!)
- Global bans
- In-game automatical match logging to website
- Score, player frags/deaths
- Ref remarks
- Randomjoin

Alright, I scrapped the hivechooser (partly for the reason there's always quite much to code) but feel free to suggest anything else that comes to the mind.

Lastly, please contact the correct people for issues.
- Website, Plugin, Server -> jiriki
- Match/League issues: Ref -> Div Admin -> Voodo

I (jiriki) am taking myself off the ENSL decision making loop. I take care of the plugin, website and server. Don't contact me for anything else. Thanks!

ENSL Staff

jiriki on 24 February 09 21:05

History | Comments: 63


By: Voodo ( Two Team Squad ) on 24/Feb/09 21:39
my opinion about the hive chooser: if two decent team plays each other (they know each other pretty well), for example on ns_lost. Everyone knows, that no one will choose alpha or equi hive, so they can prepear with a FIX tactic for cargo hive, its way too predictable, would take away a huge amount of spice from the game.
By: Vision ( Quaxy ) on 24/Feb/09 21:49
Yeah, i don't like the hivechooser idea either.
By: GibbZ ( 9L ) on 24/Feb/09 22:00
Nah they'll easily choose equi :x so good for base rushes...
By: vartija ( Ant ) on 24/Feb/09 22:54
Please restrain from changes durin season. And for that hivechanger, it's not like two equal teams are now winnin both their marine rounds.
By: GibbZ ( 9L ) on 25/Feb/09 01:41
random hives is win. It forces versatility in a team meaning they have to use different tactics for each hive. Ur never gonna do DCs for waste hive yet for sat and fusion that's the best call (debatable).
By: M on 25/Feb/09 01:54
next version with auto meta and autopilot pls

This game dosent need anymore features i dont need any info or popups I dont want a plugin to interfeer with my gaming experiance.
By: jiriki ( old people ) on 25/Feb/09 02:15
I fully realize that random hives bring some fun factor to the game, but I've also observed many teams complain about eg. lost because of its bad hive (alpha), and I hoped this could partly fix the issue. Anyway, I scrapped the hivechooser.

My philosophy is that I'm trying to keep all (except the rate checking) plugin features as silent as possible. So no extra messages unless they are important (like rate warnings).

I also agree that the servers, with bloated plugins which interfere with the gameplay or just bug you with extra popups, are horrible. That's why most of the plugin features are administration-related.

Besides, the commander messages were going to be fully optional and turned off by default. Their function is just to save the commander trouble of polling buildings. Its not a big deal as it wont command for you or anything.
By: qin on 25/Feb/09 11:53
make a poll. at 70% u start working on that hive chooser
By: qin on 25/Feb/09 12:00
Oh u did, ok.. minority rules.
By: Bacillus ( Quaxy ) on 25/Feb/09 12:01
Hmm, I could live with a hive chooser that prevents totally imbalanced hives like Alpha on ns_lost and Generator on ns_caged, but otherwise no.
By: BerglunD ( Snowrollers ) on 25/Feb/09 14:54
By: Nde ( Saunamen ) on 25/Feb/09 15:43
Div2 maybe, but not Div1.
By: jiriki ( old people ) on 25/Feb/09 15:47
As I said, I've already srapped the idea.
By: Arj ( Ant ) on 25/Feb/09 17:35
Random marine start plz (instead of a hive location) :)
By: M on 25/Feb/09 19:21
I dont like that ppl can turn on the obs sell protection.

It makes the impression that certain coms lost games to this, and requested this "feature".
By: wodKa ( Flatline-Ns ) on 25/Feb/09 19:25
(to prevent accidental obs sell)
lol can i have xmenu turned on pls?
or hows about an ensl aimbot?
so i cant accidently miss the aliens?
By: qin on 25/Feb/09 19:40
com interface is a bit sticky at times. Excluding structures from your destructive sell radius sounds good. you shouldn't have to fight the controls.
By: BerglunD ( Snowrollers ) on 25/Feb/09 20:18
i think accidental sells are part of the funny in games so why make it so strict that u cant win by a comm mistake? takes away some of the fun to blame the comm after :<
By: frG ( TROLLS ) on 25/Feb/09 20:24
Indeed, game changes like these are just stupid imo, leave the game as much vanilla as possible.
By: GibbZ ( 9L ) on 25/Feb/09 20:48
yea but when you've got Tweadle in the chair, it's not just chance about if the obs is gonna get sold, it's more a question of WHEN. I swear he sold the fucking obs every game and always would research MT to find that he cancelled it and we never would get it :(.
By: Bacillus ( Quaxy ) on 25/Feb/09 21:11
Meh, the obs recycle isn't much fun. Lagspikes and selection bugs can cause that and mess up your game quite easily. Objecting it is a little similar to objecting /stuck if you ask me.

The other features are quite irrelevant, but I guess it's ok as long as you can turn them off. Right now there aren't always enough of commanders to cover all the teams in need, so any help for the new commanders is appreciated.
By: BerglunD ( Snowrollers ) on 25/Feb/09 21:21
I think Bac wants this thing coz he is selling the obs all the time :>
By: M on 25/Feb/09 22:08
When it laags i die as fade, cause i cannt move.
I want the plugin to take over if i laag and move my fade into safety.
By: Bacillus ( Quaxy ) on 25/Feb/09 23:03
I accidentally recycle something maybe once in 200 comm rounds or so, but it doesn't mean I wouldn't be annoyed by the old flawed comm mode.

I just don't get why the luck of comm accidentally recycling something should be there. As if you wouldn't want to remove all the lags from your game.
By: Fana ( Archaea ) on 26/Feb/09 02:18
When i tryy to complain i sound like a retard, cause i cannt think.
I want the plugin to take over if i tryy to complain and write my comments for me.
By: Voodo ( Two Team Squad ) on 26/Feb/09 02:39
fana, a plugin cant be that dumb to think like you do
By: Tweadle on 26/Feb/09 04:40
I recycle something (the obs) maybe once every half a fucking round so I vote with a resounding and totally biased YES.
By: Android ( Snowrollers ) on 26/Feb/09 06:16
I vote for obama
By: frG ( TROLLS ) on 26/Feb/09 07:19
Bac wrote: Objecting it is a little similar to objecting /stuck if you ask me.

No, cause /stuck doesnt make the game easier for you, it's just a simple unstuck function needed when you hit Mr.Ben's g-spot.
By: Bacillus ( Quaxy ) on 26/Feb/09 08:35
Haha frG. Trollol? Avoiding stuckspots is as much skill as avoiding accidental recycles.

If we are going to extremes this, pistol script and 3jump for lerks are way more skill reducing than that prevention and I thought we got over those a few years ago. We might as well force everyone to go with the default configs if you consider avoiding accidental obs recycles a skill. :>

It doesn't med, scout, create tactics, res manage or anything, it just let's me focus on something else than broken parts of the comm UI.

Oh well, I think I said everything I want, feel free to disagree/troll ahead if you have to. :>
By: rapsu ( Quaxy ) on 26/Feb/09 08:47
Jeah lets go for default confs!!!!!!
By: BerglunD ( Snowrollers ) on 26/Feb/09 10:25
Bac what are you really that stupid? seriously..
Lets just make a plugin so mistakes cant be made and every match is won by the team with best plugin.. oh wait.. you wouldnt even get to play..
By: BerglunD ( Snowrollers ) on 26/Feb/09 11:29
when i looked even deeper into the bottle i got an even better idea! Lets just remove the game and let the games be won by the preds, let the ppl vote for the champions! thats means no mistakes, we solved the ping issues.. think it couldnt get better than that
By: Bacillus ( Quaxy ) on 26/Feb/09 12:56
Heh, Bergy wins the argumentation award. A fucking safety measure kicking in literally once a year is totally going to wreck the skill factor.

Wanna argue this over irc at some point? I'd really like to hear how an accidental recycle that happens to every comm maybe 1/250 matches (except tweadle it seems) is the essential skill factor of comming. Seriously, how does this differ from avoiding stuckpoints as a skill? Both require some knowledge and awarness, but still happen to almost every player sometimes and cause dramatically big effects compared to the mistake made.

I actually feel slightly smoothening the flaw could allow people to peak a little higher apm and do the actual comm skill stuff more effectively on some cases.

I still can't help feeling you're both kidding me. See you at irc at some point. I'd have already quit discussing this unless I'd really like to see that plugin feature implemented.
By: Arj ( Ant ) on 26/Feb/09 14:06
Just remove the 'quick key' to sell for the obs.. problem solved.
By: Android ( Snowrollers ) on 26/Feb/09 14:33
Gotta admit this game dosent need to get anymore "nub friendly" wasent the transformation from 3.1 to 3.2 enough? :d

From when i played at least selling obs and stuff like that, was a part of what made ns fun and unpredictable actually.... Its just so silly imo to try to make every game look more and more the same...
You will eventually just lose the fun in the game..
By: BerglunD ( Snowrollers ) on 26/Feb/09 15:18
Agree with Android, and Bac, read my post again you dont seem to get it
By: Bacillus ( Quaxy ) on 26/Feb/09 16:28
So, you're trying to say all the rounds go the same?

99,5% of the rounds go the same as before with or without the plugin. Actually I'd say the 0,5% might have more interesting stuff going on because of it, since an even round doesn't get broken by a crucial recycle or something.

As for the newbie friendliness I don't know. I've always done it very rarely, no matter the shape or skill level I'm in. I'd say it's more of an unlucky combination than any specific skill factor.

I'd be against all this if we had a dozen plugins making up for the mistakes, but I feel this particular one is good.
By: Voodo ( Two Team Squad ) on 26/Feb/09 17:12
bacillus ive lost rounds to selling obs , beacon, aliens run out, i cancel beacon (sell obs), aliens come back, BANG.

Still, im against it.
By: sublime ( Perfect Peckers ) on 26/Feb/09 17:46
Nobody uses 3jump script as lerk... if they do, they're retarded.
By: Bacillus ( Quaxy ) on 26/Feb/09 18:04
Oh well... Looks like the majority doesn't want it in, so be it.
By: GibbZ ( 9L ) on 26/Feb/09 18:26
Nah I agree with Bac on this bergy. Your argument is fucking shit :\. However I don't know if a plugin should be implemented for this obs selling.

However I'm not going to conjure some shit argument like the rest of the people here. I just like my NS vanilla.
By: BerglunD ( Snowrollers ) on 26/Feb/09 18:29
However I'm not going to conjure some shit argument like the rest of the people here. I just like my NS vanilla.

I said i dont want it, why are you then against me? o.O
By: Voodo ( Two Team Squad ) on 26/Feb/09 18:47
for me its basic line that we dont use anything that effects NS's gameplay, and this does.
By: qin on 26/Feb/09 19:41
Not more than fixing a high-tech phasegate that still allows users to get telefragged every now and then. It was fixed, wasn't it?! I'm not really up with the simple facts anymore.
By: Voodo ( Two Team Squad ) on 26/Feb/09 19:49
the last time i got telefragged was at the officical vs evil
By: GibbZ ( 9L ) on 26/Feb/09 22:34
I'm saying bergy your argument is shit :p your points are really just nil to what this plugin does.

That's all ^^
By: BerglunD ( Snowrollers ) on 26/Feb/09 22:39
lol are you not reading :D
By: Tweadle on 27/Feb/09 01:05
Everyone who doesn't comm reguarly can stfu. I reject entirely the argment that no-obs-selling shouldn't be implemented based on it's affect on gameplay. Pistol scripts do this much more consistently and, as such, has a continous impact on people's skill. In pistol scripts, we're clearly increasing performance throughout a game so when you compare it to obs-selling, a one-time prevention of something that is inherently bonked because of the comm UI, it's just silly.

I agree on the whole that we don't need to make things nub friendly blah de blah and I realise I am biased but this is not something that makes comm's better by medding for you. It's just the comm's equivalent of /stuck.

It's also retarded winning games because of stuff like that. It doesn't make the game any more fun or funny, that's also bullshit. It makes it shit and unfulfilling. It's like winning a game because the fade lagged out "OH HAHA, LOOK WE WON A GAME BECAUSE OF SOMETHING STUPID, COOL, FUNNY, THIS IS FUN" so I reject that weak argument even more so.
By: huhuh ( Danny Est Gros ) on 27/Feb/09 03:51
I dont care about the obs selling stuff

Jiriki did you read my irc pm last day?
By: jiriki ( old people ) on 27/Feb/09 04:58
Huhuh, yeah I read it. (He suggested RFK set to a constant 2)

Its most likely possible but since the game's pretty much balanced, I don't see a reason why we should start changing it.
By: Tane ( Saunamen ) on 27/Feb/09 10:22
If rfk is se to 2 it wont change balance. It just takes one random factor away from this game which is good thing.
By: Bacillus ( Quaxy ) on 27/Feb/09 10:48
Hmm... I kinda like how it mixes up the hive timing, makes comming a bit more challenging. However, randomness certainly is something that should be got rid of.
By: jiriki ( old people ) on 27/Feb/09 13:21
Yeah I agree random factors (hit registry for example) is a bad bad thing, but given the community's reaction to any gameplay-related changes, I'm not so anxious to do anything.
By: Bungle on 27/Feb/09 22:43
everyone is a gay... thats what i think... jiriki make it... but make sure there is a way to disable all the shit and make sure we dont get faggit menus and text spam all over our screen when we play.... :)
By: sherpa ( cisequaltothree ) on 28/Feb/09 02:02
Plug in looks to be coming along nicely but I'm not sure about this- dare I say- dumbing down of things: anti-obs selling, telling you when upgrades are done and I think I read something about choosing a hive?

NS in its original form is a great blend of constant (attack damage (excluding shotgun)) and random (hives, rfk). Call me an old timer but I liked it that way.
By: Bacillus ( Quaxy ) on 28/Feb/09 09:54
Sherpa, I don't think it's really dumbing down. Any decent commander can keep track of upgrade progress, so that most likely just helps new commanders to get started with the basics. Last few seasons I've seen quite a few teams missing a dedicated commander so I don't think it's a bad thing.

The obs sell seems to be quite controversial. Haven't seen any full-time commanders turning against it yet though.
By: naduli ( Exertus ) on 28/Feb/09 11:20
Any decent commander wouldn't even sell the obs in the first place.
By: Saebelzahnelefant ( Team Four ) on 28/Feb/09 12:21
it's simple, use defaulticons for comm not the ones provided with the hackpack and zomg -> you can identify shit and thus minimize the chance to make mistakes.
By: Bacillus ( Quaxy ) on 28/Feb/09 12:43
Nvm with the active commanders not opposing it then. :/ I think we can consider Tweadle a decent commander on present standards though.
By: Tweadle on 28/Feb/09 12:49
Yeah i'm amazing bacillus, thank you! And saebel clearly doesn't know what he's talking about because he doesn't realise that comms use hotkeys.

NS has always had a shortage of commanders so I would suggest that, of all the mini changes to the game, this one should be the least resisted.
By: Arj ( Ant ) on 02/Mar/09 16:21
It's probably not possible to just remove the 'hotkey' from the sell button for the obs?
By: Tweadle on 03/Mar/09 04:20
no it's not

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